israel seeks alliance with Turkey against Iran
Maybe history worm is right, after all.
Preparing for an attack on Iran, prime minister Olmert wants to see Turkey on Israel's side. As the full extent of the alliance against Iran becomes concrete, the true nature of military agreements between the two countries will eventually become clear.The Israeli prime minister Ehud Olmert arrived in Turkey for a two-day official visit with a busy agenda. He is due to have contacts with the prime minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, foreign minister Abdullah Gul, defence minister Vecdi Gonul and president Ahmet Necdet Sezer.
According to Israeli newspapers, which have given extensive coverage to Olmert's Turkey visit, Turkey's mediating role in certain issues between Israel and Syria, the Palestinian problem as well as the Black Sea-Red Sea pipeline project will be on the agenda.
However, "cooperation against Iran's nuclear program" stands out as the most crucial item of this visit. According to the Israeli press, Olmert, who talked about "enhancing the relationship which is already at a good level" before his departure from Tel Aviv, will try to get Turkey to share Israel's determination to "prevent Iran from becoming a nuclear power."
Emphasizing Turkey's role as a "a leading Muslim state which remains at the centre and which may constitute a bridge to Arab countries", Olmert implied that Turkey can play a coordinating role with other Arab countries in Israel's policy of targeting Iran.
Turkey's increasing co-operation on military issues and its bilateral agreements with Israel since 1990's indicate that the co-operation against Iran's nuclear program might go beyond diplomatic efforts.
Within the framework of the Defense Cooperation Agreement (DCA) signed between the two countries, Israel is regularly taking part in the 'Reliant Mermaid' naval exercises and 'Anatolian Eagle' aerial exercises.
While the Israeli fighter plains have been conducting training flights in the Turkish airspace from the airbase in Konya, the Israeli commandos have been receiving snow training in Bolu mountains for some time.
The military relations between the two countries are being supported by co-operation in the fields of defense industry and intelligence sharing against terrorism.
In the event of a fait-a-compli Israeli attack on Iran, it is still unclear what role Turkey would play within the framework of its military agreements, whose content have not been fully disclosed, and what the consequences would be.
Israel, which is sometimes adopting a tougher attitude against Tehran than the USA, is arguing that it would target Iran alone if necessary.
Israeli deputy prime minister and minister of strategic affairs Avigdor Lieberman has declared the other day that Israel might not wait for the approval of the international community to attack Iran. "We will have to face the Iranians alone, because Israel cannot remain with arms folded, waiting patiently for Iran to develop non-conventional weapons", said Lieberman.
He accused the international community in general and the European Union in particular for their inadequate opposition to Iran's "nuclear goals". Reporting on the possibility of an Israeli aerial attack on Iran's nuclear installations, international media organizations point out that such an attack would not be the first of its kind. In fact, Israel had launched an aerial attack on Iraq's Osirak Nuclear Reactor in 1981.
It is believed that Turkey's airspace can be used if Israel launches such an attack on Iran's nuclear installations. In the event of possible more comprehensive military operations, such co-operation might enhance within the framework of bilateral agreements. It is feared that Israel's use of Turkish territory and air space in attacking Iran might turn Turkey itself into a target.
It will.
Only the ones doing the targeting are just as likely to be israeli as they are to be Iranian.
If it is the tribal connection between the Khazar Israelis and the Khazar Turks being responsible for closer than usual ties between a supposedly Jewish state and a supposedly Islamic state... then he/she is right on target.
sullivan - You can find a great deal of what the incomparable History Worm is 'right about', in the following threads. I am the only one stupid enough to dispute his indisputable authority on this Turanian controversy, as you will note. His arcane smatterings on this subject can be found all throughout the last several months here, and if you have even a nodding acquaintance with Koestler's '13th Tribe', our History Worm can pick you up right where Koestler left off, and then leave you out howling on the frozen steppe like a rabid wolf. You will find , however, that wherever he might be heading, over those Turanical Steppes, he most always lands right on target. Don't miss out on the ride...just scroll on down... http://www.wakeupfromyourslumber.com/node/463
Why Racism is Self-Defeating http://www.wakeupfromyourslumber.com/node/584
Quasimodo makes a GOOD ARGUMENT!
I meant to look for history worm's commentary to link to.
what would we do without you?
be much less informed - no doubt.
I think it's time to do a post on pretoria. What say you?
Hi friends and foes, I just get back on the net after a long break, to find myself called on duty. Stop howling like a lone steppe wolf, Quasimodo, history_worm is back with a supplement of turanian history!
Israel and Turkey are both polities created by steppe people (Turanians - a term that applies to the Ashkenazis too and distinguishes them tribally from the Sephardi Jews who are Semites), other western examples being Hungary, Bulgaria, Finnland and Estonia (in chronological order of creation). During the ex-Soviet Union many turanic autonomous republics have been created within european Russia as well (just look at the map of the Russian Federation). The Turanians (the term comes from Persian history, I haven't created it) are a major Homo Sapiens race [the other better known three being: Semites, Yaphetites (Indo-Europeans) and Khamites] which ended up in the eurasian steppes and make up the finno-turco-mongol racial and linguistic group. The Ashkenazis are Turanians because they are unequivocally and demonstrably descendents of the judaised Khazars of history as well as of later finno-turco-mongol converts to Judaism (other steppe tribes or individuals thereof who chose to become somewhat sedentary). Turkey and ashkenazi Israel (but also the other nations I mentioned) are linked by history and tribal bondage, for one thing because the anchetype dynasty that created the first polity to gradually replace the (greek and christian) Byzantine Empire was that of the Seljuks. Seljuk himself was a Khazar general, judaic first and then turned muslim for political convenience once his empire consolidated. Later the last remnant of the Byzantine Empire was gobbled up, together with all that the Seljuks created, by the Oghus (Osmanian, or Ottoman) Turks, also coming from Central Asia and once subjects of the Khazar Empire. The Ottoman Turks were never judaised, but it is thought that the Seljuks amongst them are crypto-Jews although being nominally Muslims, the nucleus of the so-called Donmeh who are supposed to be the 'secular' force within modern Turkey and in charge of government, academia, civil-service and the top ranks of the military.
With these premises, and the suspicion of these Donmeh being secretly Sabbateans/Frankists (kabbalist and esoteric ashkenazi jewish sect), it is small wonder there is a tribal and political bondage between the turkish and the askenazi israeli establishments. Never mind the different religions (a detail). What matters is tribal bondage. Indeed, of the 5 or 6 arab-israeli conflicts none was partaken by Turkey, which always - though nominally muslim - always remained neutral. I could give you many other indications of excellent tribal israeli-turkish relations, a true entente cordiale. A small example: Abdullah Gul is the turkish foreign minister, Ehud Gol is the israeli ambassador in Malta (formerly in Italy), Jean Gol was a belgian ashkenazi politician etc. etc.. Gul, Gol, ... it's the same family name!
Quasimodo, as for your passionate adherence to Eustace Mullins' 'Curse of Canaan's esoterics: I have concluded Mullin's argumentations are all far-fetched and unscientific. History-fiction. I don't even believe in Noah's Ark's bilical account for the Great Flood and the scattering of human races, which should be replaced by more scientific recent findings relating to the birth of the Black Sea. So why should I consider Mullin's smatterings?
Now you are being HISTURANICAL ! BLACK SEA ? BOSH ! It's only the oil floating on top! Prove me wrong !
Quasimodo, do you mean 'everything is related to oil', mineral-oil, or did you mean it metaphorically? You must know that the Great Flood of the biblical (and sumeric, I mean the Uthnapishtu of the Gilgamesh Epos is the biblical Noah) lore has a scientific explanation. The creation of the Black Sea, ca. 7500 years ago, via the breaking of the Bosphorus istmus and due to land glacier melting at the end of the last Ice Age. The populations sitting on the shallow, and very fertile, sweet-water Black 'Lake' coastline zone had to flee ... thus the myth of a great flood.
I was just having a little fun and coaxing you to tell us all a little more about the Black Sea, which must have worked, because you've just done that very thing. And don't be so astounded at my howling, when you have left me staring into an endless steppe of cyberspace for days on end, without reply to my nebulous conundrums. But it's great to have you back, for however short or long an interval you may deem.... to grace us with your 'histuranical' presence.
So HistoryWorm,
is that the reason why Turkey is obligating itself to have this pipeline of gas, oil, water and electricity run from itself to Israel? So Turkey is what? PseudoZionist? Another bloody host to the zionist parasite? You mean to tell me that Turkey, despite all the evil that Israel is, will do this for Israel, probably based on this tribal historical link between Turkey and Israel from ancient times?
Well damn Turkey to hell. That would explain the fence-sitting, or pro-Israeli actions of Turkey. How sad. All this does is serve and enrich the evil That Israel is and more.
And I still find this hard to understand. Are you saying that the Muslims and Christians living in Turkey are pro-zionists? Well they would have to be wouldn't they? Perhaps there's a tribal linkage between North America and Israel too?
Nevermind about the last sentence, I'm just being sarcastic. But I am very disgusted about the support Turkey is giving Israel, to say the least.
Damn Turkey to Hell ! I only go for the white meat, anyway.
I would say Turkey is crypto-Zionist, at least its establishment is and for the reasons outlined in my last comment. Nevermind religion, I have been trying to convince you here that religion is just an aspect of culture, like language, traditions. What really matters - especially amongst Turanians - is tribal bonding! So, expect Bulgaria, Hungary, Estonia and Finnland (as well as countless other russian autonomous republics and all of the Stans of Central Asia) ALSO to side with Israel and the Ashkenazis along with Turkey. The Turanians have converted to Judaism, Islam and Christianity (even to Buddhism, Shintoism, ...), it's just details - what matters is tribal bonding. In the case of Turkey, the populace is probably not so willing to go along with their donme establishment. There are (greek) Christians still in Anatolia, Muslims, ... it grates on them to have to support Zionism. But what can they do, righly said Rhiannon!
Thanks for welcoming me back Quasimodo, I have to attend to other occupations from time to time too. To start another thread, what about this IDEA: the breakup and demise of the Soviet Union as a result (also) of the Turanian Stans wanting to exploit the gas- and oil-fields of the Caspian for themselves. To have the profits themselves and not give in to the Russians (their ancestral foes and having stolen the Bolshevik creation from them). What d'you think? Look, the first thing that happened after the USSR was declared dead by Gorbachov (a caucasian/turanian ...) was to create the Stans (Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, ...)!
- Maybe you can start by giving us a breakdown on all of the 'stans' that are currently under Turanian sway or regime, and direct connections to the oligarchs and Turanian Mob............ by naming names, and places ?
You are indeed a very demanding interlocutor, Quasimodo! I remind you of the Central Asia 'stans' (Stan is a central asian, turkik, word meaning 'country of'): Kazakh-stan, Turkmeni-stan, Uzbeki-stan, Kirgizi-stan, Tajiki-stan. All these 'stans' used to belong to the ex-USSR and are the homes of the Kazakhi, Turkmeni, Uzbeki, Kirgizi and Tajiki Turks. Yes, all TURKS. Firmly under turanian control during Bolshevik Soviet Union time (when the 'stans' were created as autonomous republics), gradual russian immigration turned the tide and began bringing ethnic russian control to these turanic 'stans'. Was that one of the major causes for the breakup of the Soviet Union? Coeval with the discovery of massive hydrocarbons deposits in the Caspian Sea area?
There's an interesting connection with some ashkenazic names in the name Uzbeki-stan. This 'Uz' is really an 'Oz' (look up the site of Turanian Nationalism), Oz is of course an israeli ashkenazi surname and 'bek' (alternative spellings 'bak', turkik 'beg' or 'bey') is the same ending as 'berg' of course. Well, in case you still doubted about ashkenazi-turkik connections ... Uzbek (or Ozbeg) was a great turkik kahn, a kaghan, of course.
Hold on, haven't finished. The list of 'stans' is not complete. Afghani-stan has long been disputed, sometimes under Iranian (Pashtun) tribal control, sometimes under turanian control. Foreign powers have always tried to seize it, because it contains (not only opium) the only passageway from Central Asia to the Indian Ocean. Nowadays, with Karzai installed by the US-UK-IL axis of evil, it is obviously back in turanian control, but it took a 911 false flag operation to achieve that goal. And, finally, we have East Turke-stan, aka the chinese Sinkiang (the land of the Uyghurs) - alas under chinese control right now.
Don't forget Canuckistan. We always get missed.
Excellent, history worm, just plain Excellent. Concise and easy to comprehend, FOR A CHANGE ! ! And ALL TURKS, TO BOOT ! Sure ya didn't miss any, ( like "Canuckistan" ? ) And howzabout those oligarchs ? Are you savin' that up for your next installment ? .............. [ And hey, you "Canuck" ! ! I got a warnin' for ya. If you ever turn out to be one of these cursed Turanians, you're gonna get MASHED, el pronto, comprendez vous ? ]
Oh yes! Masher1 is one MASHED Canuckstan! And we only found out today. Heh heh.
Quasi, you're too much. :-)
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Okay History_Worm, let me recap. Christians, Muslims living in Turkey are actually on a different level, playing field, morality, whatever as opposed to Christians and Muslims living in America, Britain, other parts of the Middle East, etc etc, as long as it isn't a STAN. As much as they hate to support zionism, as you say, they have to.
Well then they are no different than the Jewish people anywhere else in the world! The ball is in THEIR court to destroy zionism. They know what they are supporting and it is up to them to stop that support.
Muslims and Christians aren't supposed to be TRIBAL. God, family, and community in that order is their living system according to their religion. Not community, family, then God, or maybe not God at all, which WOULD be tribal.
Yeah, you have mentioned before that religion is just a detail, and I've always wanted to say to you, that is one huge detail!
But religion is not a big thing with you. It is with me. And I know religion isn't perfect, because humans have manipulated religion into imperfection; they've made it extremely complicated, even stupid and silly, and especially dangerous. But that's humans. Christian zionists are an excellent example of this. And talk about TRIBAL!
What about the Neturai Karta? They can't be tribal anymore because God comes first with them and they aggressively denounce Israel! What do you say to that?
Ellendra Jane
Hey, I guess Chanuckstan would be ... Israel? Chanuka, Hannuka, ...
And I did forget a few Stans, purposely. No joke, within the Russian Federation we have Bashkorto-stan, home of the Bashkirians (dscendents of the Volga Bulghars etc.) and of course Tatar-stan, home of the Tatars, or Tartars (nominally descendents of the Golden Horde Mongols and actually Kipchak, or Kuman, Turks). I didn't mention these because they are, strictly speaking, not independent states. Maybe there should be some more Stans, because there is a constellation of turanian tribes within Russia (Chuvashis, Maris, Mordvinians, Kalmyks, Buriatis, ...), but they don't have -stan names and status. None of these last turanian polities has oil or gas, unlike the independent Stan-states.
Regarding the role of the oligarchs in the oil- and gas-rich Stans, well you can imagine the new ashkenazi Magnates are rampant where there is quick money to make.
Regarding the Muslims and Christians in Turkey and their attitudes to Zionism, I know little about their thinking except for what I hear in the news, namely that in Istambul and other major turkish cities notices saying 'We do not serve Israelis' have appeared in some shops and restaurants. But I doubt that a force to oust Zionism will ever develop in Turanian-controlled countries because, after all, what is Israel if not the first truly successful attempt to re-establish Khazaria?
As for Neturei Karta, I would naively view them as dissident Ashkenazis rightly afraid that Israel's abominable deeds will eventually unleash new waves of violent anti-Turanism (which they improperly call anti-Semitism).